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Editions du Cerf, Reviewed by Jesse D. Stone, University of St Andrews. This volume gathers together essays produced as part of an interdisciplinary project on the historical roots of early Christian pneumatology […] A Question of Beginnings, a Debate without End The Origins of Yahwism. Introduction Among the long-standing controversial subjects in biblical studies the discussion surrounding the geographical and cultural origins of Yahweh worship sits […] Perceiving the Other Dyer editors , Paul and Ancient Rhetoric: Theory and Practice in the Hellenistic Context, Cambridge: Cambridge University Press, Reviewed by Mark W.

The closed Dutch mind: on Jesus too

Join me for research – networking – communication Markus Vinzent’s Blog Sunday, 10 May Paul Foster, Review of my ‘Marcion and the dating of the Synoptic Gospels’ First of all – before I give my comments about the above review – I’d like to express my gratitude to Paul Foster and every reader of my monograph. It is a wonderful duty and responsibility to read and write reviews of colleague’s books, as it is one of the gems of being reviewed by them. Criticism is part of this job and being criticised is what one wants when one publishes something.

Cheeky and the synoptic gospels casual dating of the gospels, and the dating of the synoptic gospels – vinzent at. The dating of the synoptic gospels at odds with introduction of the synoptic gospels markus vinzent marcion and it has survived and the. Mar 17, chicago: see also: an important one in .

Vinzent proposed that Marcion of Sinope was the founder of the Gospel genre known to us in the Synoptic literature and therefore the terminus post quem of the Synoptics should be pushed as late as the time of Marcion around CE. This blog post is not a detailed review nor a response but a survey of the ideas that came to my mind while going through it. Vinzent and the Synoptic Problem The book is intensely engaged with scholarly literature and offers a breath of fresh air for some of the topics it is dealing with.

It comes in four chapters; the first and the fourth which is pretty short are for Marcion and his Gospel while the second and the third are for discussing the synoptic problem and the dating or re-dating of the NT Gospels. Of course the reader of these words can now imagine what an overwhelmingly huge task it is to prove his point. To do that in pages Vinzent had to make two major statements that nearly annihilated all the possible barriers on the way to his theory.

He had to dismiss:

When Were the Gospels Written?

When were the gospels written? With their absence in Justin Martyr’s works, we remain with the dating of the gospels to the last quarter of the second century. The Gospel Dates When scrutinized, the Pauline epistles do not reveal any historical Jesus; nor do they demonstrate any knowledge of the existence of the four canonical gospels, Matthew, Mark, Luke and John.

In chapter 3, ‘Re-Dating the Gospels’ (62 pp.) Vinzent argues that the New Testament papyri do not make a dating of the canonical Gospels to the time of Marcion impossible and that ‘the fact that the Gospels are not quoted or referred to in Paul or in other early Christian literature prior to Marcion speaks in favour of a dating of these texts to the time of Marcion’ (p. ).

If you want to know why, read on. Because what we need to know is not whether the evidence is better attested, but whether it is as reliable. Bock does nothing to establish that the Gospels are as reliable as the sources he cites for Caesar see below. In other words, having an accurate text is of no use in comparing source quality. Bock shows no awareness of so basic a point, yet this is fundamental to any schooling as a historian.

He also fails at the facts. His premises are thus false. And therefore his argument would be unsound even if it was logically valid. But more importantly, we trust what those sources say mostly in respect to what we can externally corroborate in eyewitness and archaeological sources. We also have several eyewitness accounts.

And Livy, a contemporary of Caesar, covers Caesar in his histories—and in their poetry, so do contemporaries Virgil, Ovid, and Catullus. The Gospels are not eyewitness sources, name no eyewitness sources, and have no verifiable eyewitness sources.

Why I Think Marcion Wrote Luke

Theophilus was active in the late 2nd century, and much of the Christian narrative relies on these texts being written much earlier than that at least 60 years earlier. There was a rift building between the Johannines in Western Turkey and the Syrian community sometime before the Gospel of John was created, and the rift had to do with how mystical visions should be interpreted, and how much emphasis should be placed on them.

The Johannines were more conservative in this matter of mystical visions, and the Syrians were more liberal. As April Deconick notes:

Paul Foster, Review of my ‘Marcion and the dating of the Synoptic Gospels’ First of all – before I give my comments about the above review – I’d like to express my gratitude to .

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Marcion and the Gospels

Written while listening to Pink Floyd Holland is supposed to be tolerant and open-minded. There is every reason to boycott Holland till the censorship of economic science by the directorate of the Dutch Central Planning Bureau CPB is resolved. All nations have their problems.

Markus Vinzent,Marcion and the Dating of the Synoptic Gospels, Studia Patristica Supplement 2, Louven, Belgium: Peeters, Pp. xii + ISBN Paperback, € [1]Early on inMarcion and the Dating of the Synoptic Gospels, Markus Vinzent bemoans “the separation of New Testament and Patristic Studies,” which, in his.

For example, the setting is scrupulously laid out whereby Joseph of Arimathea is locked into a sealed room even without windows , and with guards outside. All this has some kind of meaning, and it is no doubt allegorical. And when they heard about Joseph, they rejoiced and gave glory to the God of Israel. And the rulers of the synagogue and the priests and the Levites took counsel how they should meet with Joseph, and they took a roll of papyrus and wrote to Joseph these words.

We know that we have sinned against God and against you, and we have prayed to the God of Israel that you should condescend to come to your fathers and your children, because we are all troubled. For when we opened the door we did not find you. We know that we devised an evil plan against you; but the Lord helped you, and the Lord himself has brought to nothing our plan against you, honored father Joseph.

They obviously underwent some sort of sudden religious conversion, witnessed by their radically changed view regarding Joseph. We are thus dealing here with a Jewish Christian work, yet one which has a very unusual view of Jesus, of Joseph of Arimathea, and of the link between them. And all the people met Joseph and cried: Joseph is then quizzed On the day of preparation about the tenth hour you shut me in, and I remained the whole sabbath.

And at midnight as I stood and prayed, the house where you shut me in was raised up by the four corners, and I saw as it were a lightning flash in my eyes. Full of fear I fell to the ground.

The “Historical” Jesus?

As is typically the case, I find myself in the aftermath experiencing a combination of exhaustion and exhilaration and, incidentally, in the mood to write a blog post more on why at the end. I gave two papers this year. One was on reading the death of Moses through first-century eyes and in light of the Synoptic transfiguration narratives available here. The other was an intertextual analysis of some central themes in the Gospel of John and The Polar Express available here.

Both of these papers happened on Saturday, more or less back to back, which made for a long day. But in retrospect, it was nice to not have them hanging over my head for the rest of the conference.

Marcion and the Dating of the Synoptic Gospels (Studia Patristica Supplements) [Markus Vinzent] on *FREE* shipping on qualifying offers. Are the Synoptic Gospels at odds with Early Christian art and archaeology? Art and archaeology cannot provide the material basis ‘to secure the irrefutable inner continuity’ of the Christian beginnings (Erich Dinkler); can the Synoptic Gospels Author: Markus Vinzent.

Wednesday, 9 August Who invented trousers? This time, it was not a Roman invention, but the Greeks relate it back to a powerful barbarian woman. According to ‘ancient Greek traditions’, ‘the origin of this exotic attire’ was referred to a series of different warrior queens of the East. In one of these legends, it is claimed ‘that trousers and long sleeves were first introduced by Medea, the mythic sorceress-princess of Colchis who became the lover of the Argonaut Jason’ A.

Mayor, The Amazons, Princeton, In fact, trousers were more complicated to produce than a tunic or a toga. The latter were roughly a rectangle piece of cloth, draped and mostly fastened with pins and belt as we can see them also in the wrap-around skirt of the Egyptians or the ancient and modern sari of Indian people. Trousers, however, had to be invented, and they served a particular purpose – not far from their use in modern times, linked to riding, in antiquity they were produced for sitting on horses and fighting wars.

Indeed, ‘the earliest preserved trousers have been excavated in burials of horse-riding men and women in the Tarim Basin, dating to to BC’.

Justin against Marcion

Here is a quick rundown of the sessions and papers at the Annual Meeting of the Society of Biblical Literature focusing on Christian Apocrypha. I hope I found them all. See you in Atlanta. Christian Apocrypha Section sessions:

Roth states: ‘One further problem highlights a methodological issue in reconstructing Marcion’s Gospel. On p. , Vinzent offers an (English) reading of Luke in Marcion’s Gospel. This parable is clearly attested for Marcion’s Gospel, but, in my view, the precise wording cannot be reconstructed.

He is still trying to paint a more favorable picture of Paul in Tertullian’s Against Marcion than is justified, but at least he backed down on my supposedly misquoting Tertullian. The path to this was tortuous, and long. See this link on how we went back and forth. However in the end, the change in the title of his article speaks volumes. Now Early Church has changed the issue into whether Tertullian is as negative as he seems.

In taking this fall-back position, the host of Early Church is taking the same tact as the scholar who responded to his inquiry about whether I was correct that Tertullian actually called Paul the “apostle of the heretics. He hints that Paul’s censure of Peter and the other apostles for their Judaistic leanings with his own after-practices — ‘all things to all men. A Study of Christian Origins at pages Thus, Lietzmann, despite being a Paul defender, understood Tertullian’s intention correctly when Tertullian called Paul the “heretics apostle.

Ironically, Early Church initially defended that “apostle of the heretics” was not negative, and said I should read Lietzmann who would supposedly agree with Early Church I then showed Early Church what Lietzmann said, and I never heard why Early Church does not respect Lietzmann for the same conclusion I reached.

Wikipedia:Help desk/Archives/April 2012

Blomberg, The Case for Christ 26 Because of the lack of original texts, it has been very difficult to date the canonical gospels as to when they were written or even when they first emerge in the historical record, as these two dates may differ. According to this scholarship, the gospels must have been written after the devastation because they refer to it. However, conservative believers maintain the early dates and assert that the destruction of the temple and Judea mentioned in the gospels constitutes “prophecy,” demonstrating Jesus’s divine powers.

The substantiation for this early, first-century range of dates, both conservative and liberal, is internal only, as there is no external evidence, whether historical or archaeological, for the existence of any gospels at that time.

Marcion and the dating of the Synoptic Markus Vinzent. (Studia Patristica Supplements, 2.) Pp. xi+ Leuven–Paris–Walpole, Ma: Peeters, €78 (paper). 90 8.

He began his teaching career at the University of Michigan as assistant professor of Near Eastern Studies, where he developed the undergraduate and graduate program in Christian origins. Hoffmann has also served as special lecturer in Liberal Arts at the New England Conservatory in Boston [1] [4] As a fellow at the Center for Inquiry , he was Chair of the Committee for the Scientific Examination of Religion from to , and a founding faculty member of the Humanist Institute. On the Restitution of Christianity, was published in Hoffmann proposed that Marcion must be dated substantially before the dates assigned on the basis of patristic testimony.

According to Hoffmann, Marcion possessed the earliest version of Luke and preserved the primitive version of Paul’s letters. He also attempted to discredit much of the early patristic evidence for Marcion’s life and thought as being apologetically driven.

Marcion and the Gospels

Pro First round is acceptance only. For the sake of this argument, we are assuming that some form of Christianity is true. Con has to provide reason to believe that God the Father of Christ Jesus is the same god as the god of the Old Testament. However, I find the challenge to be an admirable one, and will accept it. Report this Argument Pro I thank Kyle for accepting and find his name quite ironic as I will be building my case somewhat parallel to how some scholars think Marcion of Sinope built his case for the same argument.

As some may know, Marcion was the most prominent heretic of the 2nd century.

Mar 17,  · Markus Vinzent’s Marcion and the Dating of the Synoptic Gospels 2 comments A new book on the Synoptic Gospels has been released. Professor Markus Vinzent of King’s College London, the co-editor of Studia Patristica, has put his years of research on Marcion into his new book Marcion and the Dating of the Synoptic Gospels.

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19. The “Household” Paul: The Pastorals

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